Re: [MiNT] Fwd: Re: Re[2]: GEM boost

[Maurits van de Kamp <maurits@bassment.nu>]

> > And the trouble being...?
>
> If you don't know - use it longer!

I've been using it since Redhat 5.. not long enough to find out your grief 
with it I guess.

> My point was neither the history nor the future of Atari should be the RPMs
> on sparemint.  They are just ports of Linux apps.

My point is that RPM is nothing but an install system and it says nothing 
about the software installed with it. You don't seem to understand that.

> There seems to be this 
> mindset
> to make MiNT into Linux,

No.

> and Linux is already available, so please DON'T! 

No problem there.

> Traditionally, Atari software is installed by copying it anywhere you
> like, and
> maybe copy the .RSC file as well.  It can be moved anywhere at anytime,
> and you
> can delete it by simply removing it from your drive - toss it in the
> trash can !

That is unless it requires 3rd party tools, changes in configuration files of 
system utilities, etc etc.

> Thats user-friendly.

Not once applications become more complex and just tossing them in the trash 
leaves system files and above mentioned configuration changes etc behind. 
Haven't you noticed that Atari apps in the last 10 years have already often 
come with their own proprietry installers (but usually no uninstallers, which 
is a terrible combination)?

> of the system.  So, if windom becomes a dynamically loaded library
> distributed via an RPM  - which seems to be the direction we're heading -
> then all GEM programs will have to be installed via RPM.

Unless it's also distributed the way it is now.

> Now, due to 
> changes of the windom library, an upgrade is requried :
(...)
> This may fail and say that 10 other packages need the old version!

All this has absolutely NOTHING to do with rpm but with dynamic libraries!! If 
Windom becomes a dynamic library, you'll need to keep it up to date when 
installing new dependant software yes. This may or may not give the 
compatibility issues you mention (but if they new versions are backwards 
compatible, it won't) but you'll have that with or without rpm. And without, 
you'd have to update everything manually.

> And yes, I have seen things exactly like this in the past on redhat
> systems.

But it has nothing to do with rpm. Redhat also has an ugly logo, that doesn't 
mean MiNT will if we use rpm.

> And no more deleting something with the thrash can :
>
>      rpm -e mygemapp.rpm

Yep.. which will correctly and cleanly remove the software rather than just 
dragging what you _think_ belongs to it, to the trash.

> > What's so user-unfriendly about rpm? Is "rpm -Uvh package.rpm" so hard to
> > type?
>
> Since when did Atari users think thats its OK to go to shell prompt to
> install software?   This makes me really sad.

Even if it was, it's no problem running it from GEM. It's not even a problem 
to make a GEM frontend for RPM.

> As long as MiNT is targetted towards Linux users, the traditional ST
> user won't
> be interested.

That's still only in your mind. But I can tell by now you're really totally 
clueless about the things you're complaining about.

As we can see here, the first thing needed if MiNT is to become more standard, 
is informing people properly. ;o)

Maurits.